Patrick Todd Ferry, Business Coach at Tom Ferry International - How to Master Any Single [00:00:00] Next guest we got, we're moving through, this has been an awesome day, I have some great notes we're bringing on Patrick Ferry. We're going to talk about a framework to master any single lead source and to check if I'm butchering this man.
[00:00:18] Let me know. But that was that was what I got from you. I was like, man patches and teach me how I can take a lead source and master it.
[00:00:24] Welcome to the show. Yeah, that was fun. Fun so far, by the way. That was great. Yeah. How have you been tuning in a little bit. Yeah, definitely man. It's great. And yeah. So I think let's just dove right in on this topic of mastering any lead sauce since I've been in the real estate industry for 17 years and sales and obviously coming from the very family, like very I work for Tom Berry, my brother Matthew Ferrey. I've been around the absolute best sales people on the planet, been a part of many new product launches and services, sold gazillions of of of different products, services and you name it. And then so it really dawned on me as I delved into what was called the prospect in school at my dad's company that real estate agents really just didn't like.
[00:01:23] One person was really good with their mindset and that would get them through. One person was so good with their skills and that would get them through. Another person could be like the master of the data and get that get them through. And so I just started to notice all the nuances that were really required for lead source mastery, because it's never just one thing.
[00:01:46] And I think the biggest problem that we see in training today is most of the training in the industry is, hey, here's the lead, here's the script. You know, some stupid formula of how to learn the script, you know, that they just took from the last guy that taught them. And then good luck. Get after it. Right.
[00:02:09] That formula is for people who have grit and who have talent. They'll make it through that training. But in the position that I was in, I didn't have the freedom to be able to just be like, hey, here's the scriptures. Exactly what you should say to any lead source, whether I was an expired or fizbo or past. Clients fear a Zillo lead or Google lead or open house or whatever. Didn't matter. Right. I can teach people exactly the perfect thing to say that has been proven to work over and over again in any marketplace, any variation. And people still fail. Right, and so it's kind of like what was up with that, right, so it caused me to really reflect deeply on, you know, what are all the nuances that would cause someone to be successful, but not just successful. But this concept of mastery is really very beautiful. Right, because mastery of a lead source could literally fund your business in your career. And I think the big problem that we see today is it's worse today than ever before, is we're trying out stuff.
[00:03:23] Let me try some Facebook. We try some Google paper click. Let me try Zillow. Let me try expired. Let me try farming. Let me try this, try this, try that. And the reality is, is every single one of them works. So what's the deal. Right. But if you if you just tried it out. You're going to you're pretty much bound to fail. I find most people can get lucky, get a set, they try it out, get a sale because they got lucky, and then that funds their next six months of trial and error. And maybe they then figure out another thing and then another thing and another thing. And that's just why our failure rate in the industry is so, so, so poor is because there's no clear formula. But I do like what the last guy the coach said, like when he was talking about the advice to leaders of teams.
[00:04:28] It's really like give your team members a clear formula of exactly how it works. And then, of course, what you said, which is the combination of and then share the data and stack rank like, look, the evidence of this system working and the numbers of how this thing works. This is why you want to join my team. B, you want to follow my advice because I'm going to show you the formula that works like this is it now? Well, let's take let's now add the layer of the the mastery framework to that to help all of the team leaders out there, all of the agents out there to take their training to the next level. Right. So let's let's dig into the framework. Right. So the first thing that I noticed, Jack, was understanding the mindset of the prospect. OK, so what's going on with the mindset of the prospect? So, for example, when when we were calling expired leads in the downturn. Right. When prices were going down, I had to get my the agents to start to think through a little bit more compassionately and empathetically about the experience of the person that they were calling. And to get out of your head of I'm trying to get a listing appointment to pay my bills and to think more deeply about what their experience was.
[00:05:59] And that was a huge game changer. Now, let's let's fast forward to today is what's the mindset in the expectation of let's just say like a Facebook lead registration? It's almost like that they don't it's not even there. So, like when people are talking about like, well, I can't convert any Facebook lead at all, it's like, no kidding, because when they registered, what was their mindset?
[00:06:27] Right. And the second question is, is understanding the customer's journey. Right. So it's like, well, where is a Facebook lead at on the customer's journey then? Thought that was interruption marketing. Now, where is the the the Zillow connection call lead today on the customer's journey? They're farther down the road. They've been probably maybe on Zillow for one month to two years. And they finally filled out a form and talked to one of the team and said, yes, I'd like to talk to someone. Yes, I'd like to see this property where that on the customer's journey. Right. Same thing when when I was working on for sale by owners, one for sale by owner might have just been testing the water, whereas another for sale by owner had a motivation to be sold or under contract within the next 60 days. And we're just testing it out for two weeks. Where were they? Out on the customer journey?
[00:07:29] And I just found Zach that it's like the moment that someone actually really looked at the consumer's mindset and the customer journey, it got really easy. So what did ask and what to do was like, simple because they understood what was going on. Same thing with open houses, right. That number two in the world of mindset and psychology is understanding what's going on culturally in the industry with our mindset. So for many years, it's wild. Like if you said, hey, like if you actually showed up at a Tom Ferry event, one of the big events and you said I am a buyer's agent.
[00:08:13] People would actually look down on you.
[00:08:17] Now, why is that?
[00:08:21] Because culturally in the industry, we have a negative perception and mindset that kind of exist in the industry around working with buyers. So, you know, we got to be clear that there's this there's this weird mindset that can kind of exist. So, you know, if you have a team and you bring a new agent on to the team and you your team works some type of lead source and then your team member goes to the office sales meeting and then one of the top agents in the company is up there being interviewed at the office sales meeting.
[00:09:03] And then the team member says, hey, how do you do with this one lead source and that top agent in a glim way like, oh, I don't I would never work that source. That source is stupid, right? I tried it and it was a terrible experience. What just happened to the mindset of that new team member who we were literally about to help them to create amazing results? They immediately now have this weird negative mindset that is now going to influence them moving forward. So I found like a Zach when I just clear out the mindset for people, all of a sudden they would be inspired to perform, be there to understand the customer's journey and how to communicate with them. And all of a sudden the results would just show up completely independent of a script.
[00:09:53] That's cool.
[00:09:55] Should not even have to teach him a script that's kind of fun, right? So now if you if you actually work with them on the two mindsets, then when you show them a script, they're like, oh, this makes sense. You know, you're like, right? I mean, like, you should ask those questions and you should have these conversations. Right. So I think that's a big missing piece in the industry that we got to really put more effort towards.
[00:10:22] Right. So next next in the framework is is skills. Right. So, of course, is get your mind set. Right. And then then then let's take a look at what are the most important skill sets for that particular lead source. So the skill sets and everybody in the industry kind of is generalizes about skills, really, unfortunately. And that's OK, because everybody kind of talks about mimicking Mary Matching. They kind of been repeating the same skill sets for like 20 years. Right. I know this because I'm a fairy and this is what we like. This is what we do. But the reality is, is people haven't really taken the next step in going. Wait a minute, if I'm face to face at an open house, that skill set there is completely different than over the phone with an expired, which is completely different than the Zello connection call that I just got on Sunday morning. What I just had my first mimosa. Right. Like like what is the skill set for the lead source that's effective. So an example like let's say with an expired, I found that having deep compassion and expressing deep compassion to the expired, about their experience, about their experience and acknowledging that you feel bad for them, for what they've experienced.
[00:11:57] That's a communication skill right now at an open house. When someone says we're out shopping for the first time and they're researching a neighborhood, the skill of generating enthusiasm and excitement for them for this new venture, this amazing thing that they're about to do, that's a skill you follow me and that's appropriate for what's going on with the lead source right now. The big skill everybody is dealing with right now with which is fun I'm working on nonstop is the Zillow lead that says I want to see the property and the agent who's currently under general instruction to go show the property without really getting some qualifying questions asked. And really the ultimate goal is to get them into a buyer consultation prior to showing the property. See, this is the this is the golden ticket skill right now. Those are that's hard skills. There's a lot of nuances there that are going to be the determining factor of a bunch of agents wasting a ton of time, losing a lot of money because time is more valuable than money. Right. Versus a higher conversion rate, which would be fun because you guys will be tracking those those conversion rates. Right. So that skill set, like there's no just like here's the script, LPI Mammo. How's LP Mama right now, which is the most famous buya Internet violate script, working with the Zillah Connection call, not good.
[00:13:50] So, I mean, so what I found is there's this kind of like a lack of kind of depth into the unique skill set of each source. And we need to really treat each one and really go way deeper and get out of some of the traditional mindset. Right. I said one funny thing, one of the at the success summit for Tom, very I was on a session with a good group of coaches and I like pre we were talking about advanced influence and persuasion skills as like don't bring up mimicking, mixing and matching. If you haven't figured out that you got to have some mimicking Mary matching and pay attention to personality type. If you haven't figured that out, then you shouldn't be even on the session of advanced skills. Like it was like, you know what I mean. Like we could go on YouTube right now and watch the Tony Robbins video on mimicking magic.
[00:14:42] Do it a thousand times better than I'm ever going to do it for free. So don't waste our time together. Right. Like there's so many great resources today. It's hilarious. OK, let's go let's go to number three, which is near and dear to your guys heart. Right. Which is why I'm so excited about Sisu. Right, as a as a new platform, because number three is really the critical piece to mastering any free French source, which is understanding the numbers of the lead source. OK, this is where the game can be obviously replicable, as Tom has been talking nonstop is the lead source. Is what you're doing replicable? That is, it's scalable, replicable, scalable. The only way we know if it's replicable and scalable is a we have a framework of how we convert the leads be is if we understand the numbers of how this game gets played and then, see, you've got to show the team, you've got to show the team members the numbers so that they can see what the what the ideal end result is and how the game gets played.
[00:15:45] And talented agents, if they see that they'll play the game, non talented agents will still be in the state of tell me what to do and I'll do it. Talented agents you got do you see this? Look, look, this is a conversion rate. This is the team's conversion rate on this league source. Here's every one of the team members stack rank. This one's the most successful with that one. This one. This one. This one. This is how many appointments they're setting. This is how many offers are writing. This is how many closings they've had year to date from that one lead source. So you want to get in the game. Non talented agent of a good, talented agent, hell, yeah, put me on the board, let's go. Right. And they see that from the dashboard, which is amazing. Now, let's just go back to rudimentary stuff. OK, so the problem that I see with a lot of like I would get people in and they're like I, I called expired for like forever and no one ever answered the phone. And I'm like, no, no. How many did you call? How many people do you talk, like, measured in time. It's a joke. I just crack it up. So but then the moment I explain the expectation, hey, by the way, you're actually fine. Let's just do it from yesterday. Zackham on a coaching session with one of my new clients. Right. And she's 60 days in on Zello. Oh, my God. Everything else is brand new.
[00:17:13] It's so funny.
[00:17:16] I've done this like four times in the last six months.
[00:17:21] Oh, my God, I'm losing all this money. Tell me the numbers. Well, pull up the dashboard. How many do you get? I got 20 leads.
[00:17:36] How over how much time, 60 days, your brand new agent, right? Yes, you don't even know where your name that you don't even know who you are and what your name is and you don't even know what real estate is, right? Yes. And how many people do you have potentially that are going to work with you to. Perfect. Good job. You know what? Because that's exactly accurate. You're a brand new agent. You don't know anything. You've been given 20 pretty quality leads, which 15 of them are a complete train wreck. I knew that. Everybody knows that. You just didn't know it. But you were thinking this is the worst thing on the planet because you didn't understand the numbers and expectation. And really the two people that she has now won will be with them for a twenty thousand dollar commission check. And the other she's finally starting to develop some savageness in the 60 days, which is perfect. That other will probably buy with her within the next 90 for a thirty thousand dollar commission check. And then in the third the next 30 days, which is completing off the 90 days. Sure. Her savageness, her skill set, her comfort level will actually go to the next level and she'll pick up probably one in there that she'll put under contract and add one to the pipeline. And then as this moves forward past the 90 days, all of a sudden they'll start scaling because I understand the numbers now. Right. It's a no brainer. Same thing with expired fizbo all the way across the board. And this is why I'm excited with with what you guys are doing, because that's why I sent you guys. I said I do it. It would be so awesome if you guys would publish a badass report about all the different lead generation sources and stack rank and who's got the highest conversion rate and who's crushing what and how the sources all play out. And if Sisu did an annual report every year or quarterly report with all the top teams, that would be really cool to read.
[00:19:41] By the way, I went out to read that Zach Ha.
[00:19:45] You're talking like across the system as a whole because we have it per team, right?
[00:19:49] Yeah, I got every single right. Oh, look at this trend. Right. See, I know instinctively, right during during the last 90 days where because I coached seventy people across the United States from mega mega producers down to new agents who can't figure out what their name is because I because I have so much exposure, I was very it was very clear to me where the success came in the last 90 days from the different sources. And it was three. It was it was just like boom, boom, boom. I knew that instinctively as a coach. But it would be amazing for someone like you guys to be able to say, hey, here's what it is. Here's what we saw. The trends, right. I think it was Joe, the previous coach on here. So I did like I love what he said. He said, look, if you were focused on experience and fizbo, you've had a tough time, right, in this last 90 days. And since the inventory's gone down and depending on your marketplace, that's a it could potentially be a bad choice if you're running your whole business based on that model, unless you were to really up the game at Mastery. Right. But I digress. Right. Because we can we can let's this is how the advice would go if you were an expired. Cool. Let's pull up in two thousand and nineteen year to date. In your main marketplace is how many expired cancels withdrawn. Let's take a look. Let's do a little bit of research. Let's figure out how many actually relisted with the same age and how many listed with the new agent and then how many actually came back on the market and sold.
[00:21:25] What's your total addressable market? Cool. What percentage of the marketplace do you have now based on your current mindset, skill set, numbers, systems, tools, the way that you're operating? What's the current percentage of the total addressable market? And then cool. Now let's figure out let's take the framework and let's figure out how to fix, change and improve each one of those aspects so we can go take you from two percent market share in twenty twenty to five percent market share and twenty twenty one. OK, let's do that, but just to make a general statement that all expires is a bad choice right now and then I know your numbers right?
[00:22:10] I did a survey in San Diego, California, that I had a VA go on to Zillow, take a look at every single one of the for sale by owners that were posted, which I tracked in my CRM. And I had him go back the previous year, do a full survey. How many for sale by owners in San Diego County that year? How many of them listed, how many of them sold by themselves, how many of them took their home off the market? I understood the total addressable market super crystal clear. Now I can set my goal for the next year and get after it. I know your numbers. Right. Good. Next. Good plug for look forward to seeing what you guys are able to accomplish.
[00:22:53] I'll plug one thing here, Andy. Andy Nazaroff, another country. I love Andy. Talk about his team. And he said we're really doubling down on perceiver. Talk about this the other day, but it's really causing the opportunity to account. I pulled up his report. He said, where can I see this type of data? I pulled up the report and I highlighted three of his agents that were converting PPC like 20 X what the rest of the team was doing. Right. That data, I mean, and being able to take that and go back to your team and say, look, let's learn from these people. One, I'm going to show that these leads are converting and who's converting them and going to learn what they're doing to convert them. Right. Anyway, I thought that was a cool story. Yeah, yeah.
[00:23:34] Andy and I, we are working on the PC game right now because it's it's pretty exciting. And we've been playing with our interactive and games, these guys, which is really cool. So and I know you're connected, those guys. But you know, what you should do is take those guys and go, what's your mindset? How do we understand the consumer PC of the customer journey? Cool. What's the skill sets? What are you saying? How are you saying? What questions are you asking? How you book an appointment? What are you doing on the appointment? What's working, what's not? What what's what's the customer's experience of what you're doing? What do they like. What do they not like. Cool. Now let's go to the next point, which is a is in mastering a lead source. You've got to do three three more things, which I'll just touch really fast. Number one is you've got to have a good mastery over the tool CRM, the software. Right.
[00:24:26] Or the service provider. Right. So, for example, as you and I are both dealing with GMs, right. Or our interactive website, an agent signs up for that, doesn't do the training, doesn't create a relationship with a Zack. Right. I started getting in with with Sisu. All of a sudden I'm creating a relationship with Zack because I need to create a good relationship with. So I have someone to go to so I can learn how to use Sisu faster so they don't create a relationship with the with the great people inside of the organization. They don't do the training and then they don't go model the best in the industry for that tool, that software, that service. So what did I do? When I jumped on Sisu, I booked an appointment with Coach Mike Shoom and I said, Hey, Mike Sherm, how do you use Sisu on a coaching session? And so I went and modeled him. So we as real estate agents, we buy the tools, the software and the system. And then we don't do the training. We don't make a good relationship with the organization. We don't join and participate in the Facebook group, and then we don't go find a model to just go see what's possible. Right. So, of course, we all have a train wreck of tools and softwares in our in our closets that but we just never really actually committed to them. So then when you go and you go, hey, are you really good at lead source X? And they're like, yeah.
[00:25:53] Then when you see what they do with their tool software, the service provider that and they have their super deep of that organization, that's that's success leaves clues. Right is followed path next is in lead. Source Mastery is of course a marketing plan that makes very good sense. And the one thing I will say on marketing plan is the biggest problem I see in the real estate industry is we don't know how to construct an offer. We don't know how to construct an offer when Zach and Sisu is making an offer to real estate agents to join this success summit that constructed an offer, when I make an offer to a buyer who is relocating into San Diego. I make an offer. Here's what I do. Here's how I do it. This is the type of service to provide. This is the way that I do it. And then therefore, this is what I ask of you. And together, let's do that. Let's go. It's an offer you are thinking about selling your house. Here's what I do. Here's how I do it. Here's the way that I do it. Here's the things that I offer. You construct an offer. We don't construct offers in real estate and it's weird. And when I ask people to define their service, that's I know what I'm talking about. How do you define your service?
[00:27:14] And then, of course, in marketing, our goal is to level up the perceived value of the service that we offer.
[00:27:25] That's the goal, marketing, right? So we've got to get better at our offers, we've got to get better at leveling up the perceived value of our offer so that the consumer is like, wow, when we post something on social, do a direct mail, we do an email.
[00:27:40] We do anything the consumers like. Yeah, I want that. Yeah, right.
[00:27:46] We had a great, great call yesterday with Marilyn. You have to check it out on track yesterday. And it was just all we talk about is a lot of times as an agent, as a team leader, as a broker, I think people know what I do and think because I live it, that it's so apparent. A lot of times it's just this is what I'm going to do for you if you can just clean and precise communicate that boom. That's it. That's an offer.
[00:28:12] Yeah. One hundred percent. Last last two things. We'll just hit this fast because I know we're going to our last is constructing the ideal schedule. Right. I think people underestimate if you want to master a lead source, you actually really need to look at how much time do you need to spend on training? How much time do you really need to spend kind of in the kind of maybe prospecting and the follow up, maybe developing your understanding of the tool, the CRM in research mode and also for appointments? I think people really underestimate how much time is required for someone to create mastery of a lead source and really looking at what the ideal week should look like.
[00:28:55] So really creating an ideal schedule. Right. And if someone's like you should be doing this old classic, you know, my father created the classic schedule of the I used to prospect from 8:00 until 11:00, like, OK, cool. But like, what else? You know what I mean. What is appointments in the afternoon. OK, sounds great. Any other suggestions you got there. What else am I like. What am I supposed to do. Some research. What am I supposed to do this or am I supposed to do that. What am I supposed to actually learn how to do any of this stuff? Like we've got to construct an ideal schedule for people to make it more clear that's based on everything that's really required in the industry. Right. And last thing is and this is where Sisu kicks in, a financial goal specifically for the lead source. We're going into business planning season. All I want to do is I want to go. Zach, pull up your Sisu account. Cool. Let's look. Lead source, go across how many sales you did. Sales volume, GCI, how much money did you make. Awesome. Now twenty, twenty one.
[00:29:58] What are we going to fix. Change. Improve in all of the, the, the categories here. Mindset, skills training, the marketing plan, improve any of these areas. If we fix change, improve all these things then in twenty, twenty one total addressable market is cool. Your conversion rate was how do we take it to. This number of sales and then actual average sales price was in that category. You're now sales volume, your GCI congratulations. We now have a financial goal for the lead source. This is lead source mastery. This isn't just here's a script. Here's the leads. Have some fun. Call, call, call. Got more appointments. Yeah. Give me a break.
[00:30:46] Yeah, yeah. With the sauce. Right.
[00:30:50] Yeah. The consumer. I love what my brother says. The consumer deserves a better experience. Right. And my main thing I'm working on with all my coaching clients right now is, look, how do we get you away from being a sales agent and convert you into a real estate consultant? Yep. Right. Because people want a real estate advisor, your friends, your family, your community. They want a real estate advisor. Real estate is one of the most beautiful wealth creating assets on the planet in the United States. And you're a sales agent trying to get a listing, trying to get a try and get something sold. You're an idiot, right? Be an advisor and let's start figuring out how to help people improve the quality of their life with the home that they own and improve their wealth and their financial well-being with the asset. Let's become advisors. Right. Let's get let's let's step up our game right now, obviously. And I love probably more people talked about being treating this more like a business naturally. Right. Naturally, Patrick has been great.
[00:32:01] Man. I'm going to tee up one question for you, Rapid Fire. I'd love to hear your answer to this. What's from your perspective? What the lead.
[00:32:09] Thank you, Joyce. Beautiful question. And the answer is very simple. It is the one that you are blessed with. The one that you are best with, if I if you were to coach with me, I would just track back in history where have you been the most successful? And it would be so easy to see what you Jois are amazing with where you excel, where you're comfortable, where you're confident, where you naturally gravitate towards. And without a service like Sisu, we can't see that stuff. And we're stuck in our head, in our opinion, getting distracted by the latest new thing. And so it's very important that we look at where we excel and what we're good at and what's trending in our marketplace today and make sure that we are perfect at that one.
[00:33:01] Thanks for the top choice.
[00:33:03] I would say I'm a little different. I say the best the best lead is the converted one.
[00:33:07] Right. But I think I would say, hey, look, I don't care how I get the commission check. I just like commission checks. So I don't know Biase as a buyer or a seller or whatever.
[00:33:23] I don't care. I'd just like to do I says open houses.
[00:33:26] That's her, that's her game. I love it.
[00:33:29] She's amazing. Right. So now she needs to translate that into today's modern world. We get her into a better face to face experience and then really leverage in on that. Right.
[00:33:41] And thank you for coming on. We'll be in touch with you guys, have more reports and Sisu. We're going to get some of that in the lead source for that. I love it. So, yeah.